Rich Morris' Comics - YAFGC and The ComixBlog

But another war isn't exactly "new territory", is it? As pointed out, we've already had two. Also, I think you miss Makkabee's point, which is not anti-war at all.

Any treaty would be not much more than a Macguffin, an excuse for interesting new stuff to happen; but if you want that new stuff, you've got to have the Macguffin Treaty. In fact, if you want to see Clover the *Rogue* in action, you would pretty much need Drostardy to be in a position where fighting a war would be a very very bad idea. This ties the hands of the warriors and sets the scene for cloak-and-dagger shenanigans, the sort of thing that sneaky rogues are made for.

(Personally, I have this vision of Gommer popping up in the Drostardy court, questioning the validity of Clover's marriage to Eric. That would be awkward in the extreme....)

Miseri, no, Makkabee's post was very much an anti-war / anti-Bush. Read it again. If you still don't see it, have someone else read it and explain it to you.

As for a new war not being new territory, it would be if it is with a new kingdom. Literally new physical territory. New lands, new people, new everything.

As for what can cause cloak-n-dagger situations, read up on the Cold War. Read any James Bond novel. Treaties are not necessary at all. And if you read my original suggestion again, you'll see that I wasn't advocating an all-out war for Clover to go "rogue". Just the opposite. I was suggesting she sees what's really going on around her and goes after the one causing it. By the evil mastermind killing off all but Makkabee-type members of the royal court, who naturally think that sweet words will melt an evil heart. They oppose strong measures Clover advises and eventually forces her to take matters into her own hands.

And if you're going to run a black ops mission, tapping certain established characters to help her with it wouldn't be unrealistic. Glon is always up for adventure and he could recruit others from the mountain. Even Arachne who would be the ideal candidate for an interrogator that they'll obviously need to get information out of hostiles as they move closer to the evil throne. As for getting them to help, that's easiest of all. All Clover has to offer is gold.

You know, Clover is still Rogueing it up while Queen. She sneaks in and out of the castle, has set up traps to keep people out, has maintained ties with the Assassine's Guild, created an extensive spy network and I'm sure she's keeping her eyes open for political threats. The thing is, it's mostly been off panel since the story focuss has been elsewhere. We don;t need a war to show anything like that, we just need the story to shift focus over to her as she continues to be herself.

DM, would you please make a comment about this discussion?

Why? So far everyone is dealing with provocation like adults and staying reasonably on-topic (in so far as it's still about plot ideas for Clover). If it turns into a fight between people rather than about ideas, or if the American politics becomes an overwhelming issue, I'll move those posts to more appropriate threads. Mallard, if you want to take people to task personally instead of just discussing the content of their posts, you need to do it in 'Why You Annoy Me.'

But I will say this - Americans need to realize that they are not the majority on this board, and not everything is about them. Especially considering that the comic, which is the only thing on-topic in this section of the forum, is set in a fantasy world where there is no North America or USA. The place for political debate would be down in Tangency.

You're right, folks have been behaving like adults in this discussion. I admit, I should have been more restrained.

Back to the discussion, then, and all the best!

Timemonkey, I agree. It seems to be mostly off-panel and that's a shame. She's my favorite character and the main reason I keep reading this webcomic. That she's back in the spotlight again makes me happy. That's why I've posted here again after almost a year of not doing so. I then suggested an idea that might give BK some fodder for later Clover adventures in-panel.

Personally, I don't really care what gets Clover more panel time. I just suggested what I thought would be interesting for ME to read. I was not looking to make this a political discussion at all. That someone did view it that way wasn't my fault nor do I feel it is improper for me to counter a negative attack on my suggestion and word usage (i.e., the usage of the word "weak").

DM, I do not believe I have taken anyone personally to task. I am trying to address opposing views to what I'm proposing. That's all.

And if Clover could prevent an all-out war by way of espionage (a.k.a. going rogue), that would be even better. Made even better if she killed off the evil king that would bring shame and snickers to his legacy.

In this spin on the idea, Clover sees the cloak-n-dagger stuff going around her but no one else in the court does because they're not as good of a rogue as she is. She tries to do the court thing to make people aware of what's really going on, but she's just not that good at it and, due to make-peace-at-all-costs advisers being the ones that are not being killed thus gaining more and more of a voice in the royal court, she eventually throws up her arms, puts on her old rogue gear, and goes to tackle on the problem herself at the source. She tells Eric that she's going to go visit family for a bit and Eric agrees and wishes he could also escape the mess that is his royal court. A mess secretly caused by the evil king. She then goes and enlists Glon and others (very reluctantly Arachne) and high-jinks ensue. Eventually, she kills the evil king but makes it look like he died during a too-serious royal function by slipping on a banana peel and tumbling down a staircase to reveal he had on funny underpants under his royal garb. Clover then sneaks back to her castle, tells Eric that her family is doing fine, and finds the problems are no longer plaguing Eric. Now if you wanted to have a twist at the end, you could have Eric say, "Oh really? Your family visit went just fine?" Clover, "Yes, dear." Eric, "Odd since your family arrived the day after you left and has been here ever since." Clover blushes. Eric, "Now tell me how you came to my rescue again." Clover smiles and begins to say, "You remember how Earl Nose-in-the-air, your treasury adviser, died while counting gold. It wasn't an accident. What really happened was..." Story arc ends.

You're the one equating Bush and war. I never mentioned the guy.



It makes for perfectly good drama for anyone sophisticated enough to appreciate character driven drama, personality conflict, shifting alliances, efforts to outwit one another, etc. Look at The Lion in Winter, in which a treaty negotiation between the kings of England and France was one of the central plot threads of the play/film. I trust you're not telling us that it wasn't good drama because there was only one real sword-fight in it.



Now you're making a straw-man argument, implying that I consider Eric weak. I'll devote all the attention to refuting that that such an argument merits.



I want to be very careful not to misinterpret this. Are you calling me weak and/or incompetent, or saying that any of the options I've advocated indicate incompetence? This statement could be read as a deliberate provocation, but if it was just poor word choice on your part I don't want to respond rashly.

War is sometimes a necessary evil. It should never be the first option people consider, and in the event it does become necessary the party driven to war has a responsibility to its own people to make sure everything possible has been done to ensure the war is winnable.

Makkabee, think whatever you want. I'm not going to reply as it only further fans the flames.

On a different note, I'd like to see more Clover/Lucas interaction. Thye seem pretty friendly and I'd love to see them, maybe they could swap stories about Glon or something.

This is a character thread, guys - absolutely fascinating topic, but not appropriate here at this stage. When I have a chance (lunch, likely), I'll start a thread in YAFGC misc and move the vasselage posts there.

New thread is here: Fealty, Homage, Vassals and Kingdoms.

Clover the halfling, Clover the rogue, Clover the Queen... she is not my favorite character but she is one of the more interesting and fleshed out as she seems to operate equally skillfully in every situation and still remains herself.
What i am saying is that no matter what the situation, the characters will shine through.

True. The only ones who have as much background in strip are Maula Bloodhand and Lewie the Lich.

BTW, we need more Maula in the strip. She's further proof of the general awesomeness of the non-helpless fantasy female, and a good role model.